Miata Mailing List: September 1996, Message #0164
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   From: dans@dmscomp.com (Dan Scolnick)

Subject: Re: Air Bag data from NHTSA

   Date: Mon, 2 Sep 1996 17:56:53 -0500



Prof (soon to be) Jason,



        I hope we can create a helpful thread.  1st I have to tell you there

is a general rule (it's one of the corrolaries to Murphy's Law):



        "Never argue with an Idiot, people may not be able to tell 

        the difference"

        

        (:



That said, I think you'll find the NHSTA supports both of our positions.  I

prefer to look at the basis of their findings to see how they come to their

positions.  I'm not arguing against the idea of an air bag.  I'm trying to

unemotionally point out the design flaws and drawbacks in the hopes of

getting getting something far better than we currently can get.  I also

mistrust quoting the governments opinion on it's own legislation and turning

it in to sound bites.  That's called propoganda.  If you believe that you'd

also believe that:



I won't c-m in your mouth

The Check's in the mail

I'm from the government and I'm here to help you.  Onwards:





Jason States:



>Although my search has only yet begun, here's the latest data I've found.

>This data supports my previous posts.

>******************************



mine too.



>Air Bags

>

>          Air bags inflate instantly 



                by the use of an explosive ( I have a problem with

explosives designed by government mandate and implemented by companies

looking to do the most inexpensive job possible existing inches from my

nose.  Ready to explode during a crises situation. )





>in frontal crashes to prevent occupants

>from hitting the dashboard, steering wheel or

>          windshield at speeds as low as 15 mph.



        Isn't this what a seatbelt does?  By the way, seatbelts stretch (and

don't stretch back).  It's that stretch that keeps it from cutting through

you.  If you've been in an accident where the seatbelts restrained you in an

impact they should be changed.  It's part of the repair.  I would add that

if the airbags inflated you should probably change the seatbelts too.



        If the seatbelt keeps you from hitting the dash, wheel, etc... how

can you attribute live saved soley to the airbag, or even partially to the

air bag?

        





>Air bags do not eliminate

>the need for safety belts, and offer no

>          protection in rollovers, rear, or side impacts.

>



        Thats why they are called SUPPLEMENTAL RESTRAINT SYSTEMS.  you don't

see race car drivers who walk away from spectacular ultr-high speed crashes

using air bags, eh?







>                                          WARNING!

>

>           While air bags have saved 1500 lives over the years, they can be

            ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^



        This is the one I have REAL PROBLEMS with.  It is spoken like a fact

when, in fact, it's an opinion.  How was this number arrived at?  Were these

1500 people not wearing seatbelts?  If they were wearing seatbelts how can

you attribute  'SAVED LIVES' to the airbags.  How do you know they would

have died with seatbelts?









>deadly for children. Kids are

 ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

  Ah! this one is a fact, not an opinion.



>           always safest in the back seat.



                Hmmm, Can't seem to find one in most of the cars i'd like to

drive.





>If kids ride up front

>

>                Never use a rear-facing child safety seat in the front seat

>of a vehicle with a passenger-side

>                air bag.



        Neither fair nor reasonable.



>

>                Always buckle-up your child and move the vehicle seat as far

>away from the air bag as

>                possible. Unbelted kids can be killed or injured by an air=

> bag.



        Don't want my kids to have explosives that close to their faces either.



>Jason Powell



Dan Scolnick

Team Adjunct Associate Professor

----------------------------------------------------------------

/^\dan & Tweedle the Heretic a '94 'R'ed  -  EMBRACE HYPOCRISY

A Disarmed Air Bag is a safe Air Bag         Who Are You?

Team VOODOO & SHORT SHIFTER         -   Remember Humpty Dumpty

'70 Dodge Challenger R/T 440 SixPack  - I will not live in fear

1991 Hobie Miracle 20' - 'Hazardous (when wet)'

1996 Hobie Magic 25' - 'HOLD ON . . .(to what?!)'

Writing to you from the capital of the world-

New York, New York (So dangerous we warn you twice)

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